Communicating With Authenticity

Rachel Cossar: Welcome everyone to another episode in conversations in the future of work, where I am joined by incredible leaders, thought leaders, coaches and researchers who are all leaning in to this new evolution of our workplace. Today, I am thrilled to have on a show, a fellow, facilitator and partner Richard Richard. So I’m gonna hand it over to you, Richard, to please just introduce yourself to our audience.

Richard Richards: Great. Thank you, Rachel. Yes. I’m delighted to be here as than are facilitator on your show, and particularly, when we’re talking about anything to do with virtual presence or the way that we come across in the virtual world. I as you know Rich, I’ve been working now for for aerial about the last eighteen years. And since twenty fourteen, I’ve had up the practice around virtual community association virtual training. And I think the introduction of technology as a way to begin to prepare people to think about their virtual presence it’s just an awesome use of technology. So I’m delighted to be here. My practice sort of broadly covers on areas of coaching whether it’s presence impulse or presence virtual. But clearly the shift to a world where we’re working hybrid working in a virtual mode means that virtual presence becomes even more important going forwards.

Rachel Cossar: Yes. Absolutely, could not agree more. So I think we can dive right in to this conversation, which as you fore will combine both… Presence and communication best practices, but then also how technology

Richard Richards: Sure.

Rachel Cossar: kind of comes into the equation. So something that I wanted to touch with you because it  comes up almost time I facilitate or coach myself. Is this pushing past boundaries of comfort. Right? When we think about the way most of us are, we we sit in our comfort zones, and we’re quite happy and we start to develop this identity of authenticity around this comfort zone, And then you have an amazing coach like yourself show up, and start to disrupt that a little bit. So when you are facilitating do you help people either shift their concept of what is authentic for them, so they can grow and improve, especially with, like, when it comes to something as personal as communication.

Richard Richards: No. And it’s a super question clearly relevant to the work that you and I do, Rachel. And and I think my first answer is is is first of warm, we think about the comfort zone. Typically the comfort  as something as you said, we’re used to. It’s almost like it’s our default behavior.  And default behavior isn’t always the best behavior. So I think anytime I disrupt comes in like you or I and challenges people. We’re actually doing a good thing. Just to make sure that what your default behavior is is it the correct to default behavior? I think the second thing is that when I frame this idea of sending yourself in outside the comfort zone into looking at new behaviors or new ways of showing up. I always frame it as what’s in service of the people you’re talking to? Because really to some extent, it’s not about you it’s about the people you’re trying to relate to the people you’re trying to communicate with or you’re trying to present to. What’s in service of making this easier for them? To connect with you and understand you. And I think what we underestimate is that the same an amazing actual stretch that we have that’s still within authenticity, that allows us to change the way we show up that serves the people that we are speaking to it in a much better way. And I think what what we underestimate is the fact that our authenticity is is is what it is, but it does have space to grow it has space to change. And also, I think it ships based on who we’re with, what is the context? What is the situation?  I’m gonna shop authentically with one way with my forty year old son for example, they’re very diff with my fifty year old boss, but they’re both authentic. And I think what we underestimate is the idea of identity and how we show with a four year old, oftentimes some of that likeness and that improvisation nature,

Rachel Cossar: No.

Richard Richards: that emotion is also relevant when we’re speaking to different audiences. But for some reason, we can compartment it? And how do we be into span that idea of what we can do and what we… And what we should be able to do.

Rachel Cossar: Yeah. That’s a beautiful way of putting it. And you know what it brings up for me is this distinction between being like a d facto introvert or ex. And it’s really interesting. Says conversation over the summer with my mother and her partner. And her partner is a geo. And he he is like, I’m an introvert, through and through and through. But I was with him at an event at with a room full of geo, and I had never seen its man be so ex ex and expressive enthusiastic. And I was like, Oh, my god. I was like you in this context, you were so authentically, like, getting energy from these people around you, You’re like an ex. So  it’s just funny how people will tend to grapple with these kind of one liners around their identity. Like, I am this. I am that and it can sometimes hold them back from, like really,  calling upon their full selves depending on the context,

Richard Richards: I think what you’re hitting on  it’s actually really the core of all good coaching rate is what is the story that we

Rachel Cossar: yeah.

Richard Richards: ourselves. What is the free word reference that we’ve got used to having? And are we willing to reframe how we think about? Ourselves or reframe what we think our authentic self is. As as it relates to different situations. So clearly with geo, He’s an accountant audience people he knows people he can relate to. But recognizing that he can do that. Means okay. So  would that look like in a different audience? What would like, look look like in a different situation? Again, it’s one about the story that we tell ourselves, that sometimes we don’t always tell ourselves the best story. And we are ultimately what we think.

Rachel Cossar: Right. Right Lily… I mean, we… I could keep talking about this. For forever But let’s let’s move on to the next question, which kind of this brings us to where we sit. Where a lot of our communication professionally sits today. And like, what are your thoughts on communicating over video? And developing that real human connection.

Richard Richards: So about ninety percent of my coaching and secular coaching is all on video. And clearly, I’ve gotta build a real connection there. Otherwise, the coaching conversation will go nowhere. I think it is possible. I think what we need to recognize is, though that And and if you’re as old as I am Rachel, you’ll remember you’re telling that your mom telling, can phone. This calls costing you have fortune God knows long distance causes are so expensive. So I remember I’m sort of programmed you, like at a Dna level, to think about having quick efficient virtual interactions. And I think that’s something that we need to sort of address and make sure we’re not falling into the… Again. That to default behavior. I think the other thing is if we realize what it is we can do in a virtual world to actually connect with people. And when I talk look about presence and the ability for us to connect with other human beings, In the in person world, we know what we do. We know how we show up physically with facial expression with body language, how we sit, where we put ourselves we’re we position ourselves, how we show I’m listening and all those other things. When it comes to the virtual world, we forget to substitute the things we need to do in the virtual world to make up for what we don’t have. So clearly, I think if  like you’re doing now. You’re not in beautifully as so I’m talking here Right? You’re indicating you’re listening. I know you doing to substitution technique right. As I talk to you here I look at the camera, It these things that we can do that we can still demonstrate my focus is on you and the audience.

Rachel Cossar: Yeah.

Richard Richards: I’m not on myself. And I’m making an effort, and I think The other thing was working virtually and making connections. We have to work just a little bit harder.

Rachel Cossar: Yeah.

Richard Richards: So I think, for example, if we look at this idea of vulnerability to share just a little more of ourselves perhaps virtually we might in person. We have to listen this and little harder. And if I do listen, I have to show you I’m listening by reflecting back some of the words or phrases you said. By demonstrating, I’d understand what’s important to you what you value. So I have to work a little harder at listening. And then also I think when it comes to body language, we under stand just how important it is that we still think about our body language in a virtual setting, sitting here as I am at a sort of a a fairly upright chair. And conscious about how I’m coming across. I’m making an effort to make sure. I’m not dialing back my body language or my expression. Just In person. And if you think about it, the greatest metaphor for, you think about the greatest film is right. And the money that they spend on lighting and cameras and I’m directing people is because they know what it takes. To attract an audience through a medium like film or television or radio.

Rachel Cossar: Yeah.

Richard Richards: And I don’t know that we always think about our virtual interactions in that way.

Rachel Cossar: I’ve said since the beginning of of the pandemic actually and really act activating this channel of video that I think there’s such an interesting dichotomy between the entertainment that we so readily accept in films and movie like People sit in front of the Tv for hours and develop relationships with characters. Right? So it’s not the two dimensional virtual channel of connection, that’s the issue. But in our professional lives, we view these screens as, you know, where we get our work done. As a very non human kind of technology. Right? And so you’re you’re exactly right, I think in in touching on that, like, think about how much goes into filming a a blockbuster video or even like a short film and how powerful that can be. And how do we start to think about some of the tools we have at Artist disposable not to make this like a huge produced.

Richard Richards: No.

Rachel Cossar: Thing, but but to remember that body language matters, to remember that eye contact can be very powerful that active listening and showing empathy and rapport, translate over video because and I’m sure you’ve seen some of these studies come out, which the studies themselves are fair, but sometimes people kind of mis the the conclusion and they’re like, you can’t build trust over video. And you’re like, I’m like,

Richard Richards: Oh, no.

Rachel Cossar: Oh, this please not. Let’s just not do… Let’s not go there.

Richard Richards: It’s so feel they know.

Rachel Cossar: You know,

 Richard Richards: You know… What’s sort coming… Listen to you here. One of thing is really time them if I think about it Just watching the Bbc. Right? And on the Bbc, there’s a news article about Matthew Perry for

Rachel Cossar: Yep.

Richard Richards: and the people who are lining up outside the building that was supposedly the building where that whole program was film. And you think about there an emotional connection with a character, And what that means to people and the connection he had with hundreds of thousands of people,

Rachel Cossar: Yeah.

Richard Richards: I mean, it’s so in some respects, you know, what we’re talking about there, that is when the person is not necessarily intentionally trying to connect with you through the camera, but with his colleagues.

Rachel Cossar: Yes.

Richard Richards: So imagine how much more possible it is if you really work at it,

Rachel Cossar: Yep and you’re really trying to connect another person through the camera. Right. Right. Absolutely. And in a sense, I feel like understanding this channel for what it is is just another. Super power in your toolkit to then become more of a versatile. Professional communicator, you know, really understanding the channel and being able to  show up in the way that makes most sense for that for that channel.

Richard Richards: And I think that’s the challenge. I don’t think people have come to recognize full year that this is or should be part of a toolkit.

Rachel Cossar: Right.

Richard Richards: Because I one of the biggest challenges I just discovered when I started teaching back in twenty fourteen.Was actually not necessarily the techniques. The techniques I picked up from, you know, one for  people like like, the designer who design the program and yourself, people But what I think the biggest challenge was was actually changing it expectations of the people that come to virtual interactions  but they actually can be engaging. No my god. You mean, I can’t multitask

Rachel Cossar: Yeah.

Richard Richards: You mean I can’t the laundry brush the dog, do my emails, paint my nails. I’ve got actually gotta to listen and participate. Because people expect they have such low expectations of virtual interactions.

Rachel Cossar: Yep. Right. Right. Yeah. Absolutely. And not that that’s that’s that’s gonna take I think some time, but hopefully hopefully we can get there.

 Richard Richards: Well, people like yourself and the tools that you’re producing a… The starting point begin to. Shift that perspective.

Rachel Cossar: Right. Right. So let let’s go a little deeper on that. When it comes to, you know, using different tech Right? Because I I think in coaching, specifically, coaching has for so long been such a human to human experience, and now we have these technologies that are coming in and introducing themselves and you know, for some coaches, it can be very, very scary and intimidating. And, you know, for others, it can be very fascinating opportunity. So look like, what what do you think about about balancing that?

Richard Richards: My great question. In fact I was on the phone this morning with a profit in London that I’m starting to work with now. And I’ll be coaching the executives around fundraising presentations. And there’s nothing more sort of personal life foundry representation when you’re telling the story about a child that you’re helping, and you’re trying to connect emotionally heart minds with Audience members. And I think about how I’m using blended technology there. Right? They’re gonna send me videos  of the stories that they want to tell. They’re gonna send me in in in in Powerpoint the decks they wanna present. I will look at those. I will load them into a platform such as room. I will give them feedback. Through Loom about what I’m seeing in their stories. And then I will meet them in person and with take to pieces their stories, But more importantly, we’ll focus on how they then themselves present the story to the audience, So it’s a blend sort of pre work using technology and then actually being in person with the client. And I’ll offer sometimes times do that, Allows people do some work with on platform. Said go ahead and do a presentation for me and just film it for me Send it back to me. So I’ll load it into a platform I can get a transcript of it. I can out the number of arms and hers and filler words they’re using, I can look at the quality of the of the way they’re presenting, and then I can give them feedback there. On the video in in different bullet points,

Rachel Cossar: Yes.

Richard Richards: flagged for them to know where to go and both the written concepts coming through the transcript. So the phenomenal ways of using this in a deeply personal way but not only she allowed you to do that but also gives them a permanent record, of your feedback and what they’re doing, which I think if you think about in person coaching that you’re not Richard Richards: porting, you don’t have that luxury. Now they have a video they can go back to with the Richard Richards: feedback. And certainly, when I’m doing group coaching, what I’ll do is I will record  the feedback from the other people who are observing the coaching situation So the person gets my feedback and their colleagues or their peers feedback. And they can review that quietly later on.

Rachel Cossar: Right. Right. Yeah. I mean, for for platforms like that, the amplification of your work as a coach and the different touch points and the record keeping as you said is amazing. And then what about… I mean, like, taking it the next step. Right? Like, what about some of these, like, virtual sapiens for example? Right? Ai like, Ai that’s doing some of the coaching. Like, how like, how how do balance that?

Richard Richards: So I think It that’s a great question. So first of all the the other platform it clearly also has Ai in terms of counting the number of filler the words, and then I can pick out the filler words and a way it goes. And starting with something like Virtual Sapiens, what brilliant about virtual sapiens is it gives people a  a whole bunch of different readings. That’s around different dimensions. It’s a really important two. The other person to the audience. So they’re getting a reading on

Rachel Cossar: Right. So

Richard Richards: how they’re showing up, with specific feedback on specific dimensions. And again, like, all… If you like psycho tests. Virtual sapiens or any other technology is not the bill on end. It’s not the final answer it doesn’t short at that moment in time. But what it does do Is it gives you a snapshot of what how you’re being perceived and then it gives you choices. And you’re gonna have choices system, change things for not changing. Ultimately, I think when it comes who learning and development is is adults, right, And and pretty much with teenagers as well.We wanna have choices about what we learn on how we learn and what we choose to do differently. And again a two right virtual theme sen you what could change. And if you could change what it would do around I mentions like trustworthiness, or or or perceived have, you know, expression and other dimensions so I think it’s enormously powerful Correct The other thing is This idea of allowing yourself to do it once, get a benchmark greeting, and then try on for things you want to try on weigh in a different reading. How cool is that?

Rachel Cossar: Mh. Mh. Yeah. Absolutely. We love actually when people use our tool to test different habits. Right? Like going back to our first question of around authenticity and, like, developing and re rewire new behaviors. Sometimes we’ll see people go in and, you know, initially, it’ll it’ll be like, you didn’t use… You you you we didn’t see your hands at all.

Richard Richards: Yep.

Rachel Cossar: You know? And then they’ll be like, okay, And then they’ll do it again and be like, I was told to use my hands. I’m gonna just use my hands a lot, and then they use… And then in the next round of. It’s like, you use your hands, but you use your hands to the point where it was almost distracting. So like lower and then people are like, oh okay. So now I have to be a little… Let me be more intentional about this, Like, what feels right? And what is then perceived as an asset in my communication. So we love it when people play around with a tool like that.

Richard Richards: And I think to your point early on, clearly it’s you state the idea or authenticity and how we change ourselves deeply personal. So the idea that you can actually practice it in the safety of a piece of technology where nobody else is watching where nobody else is going to see it. And try these skills on in that way. Mean, how cool is that when you’ve got a really safe psychologically safe space? To distressed stuff fun, And particularly, if you are us small on that introverted scale. You don’t wanna make yourself look foolish in front of other people but it’s it’s already safe space to do it. And we all know that learning comes through repetition. You wanna make change you need to repeat what you’re doing if before actually sticks.

Rachel Cossar: Yep. Yes. Absolutely. Yeah. That was one thing that surprised us, actually. I was I was nervous personally people would not want to receive feedback from Ai at all, or or feel more heavily judged by the technology, but in actual fact, people have found it a little bit safer to to practice some of those things in front of what they perceive as a as a very objective measure, right? Versus… I mean… I think it’s different if they’re working with a professional coach. But sometimes within general workplaces is getting feedback on your presence is like, really hard and and very touching and very all and sometimes, you know, oftentimes people don’t do it so well. So

Richard Richards: It’s also but his units also open to potential buyers by the facilitator too. You have you had a sell bias in some particular way

Rachel Cossar: Yep.

Richard Richards: skin counter sex, or orientation, whatever those things are right, there’s a danger that that’s cloud what they’re saying and how they’re saying it.

Rachel Cossar: Right.

Richard Richards: So I think there’s also something about the the the fact that virtual sapiens comes in with you no pre judgment about any of those qualities that it comes just a piece of information. I think the other thing I’ve discovered in using Virtual Sapiens, the way we have done in workshops is to also clearly position it positions it not necessarily as black and white truth

Rachel Cossar: Yes. Yes.

Richard Richards: but at the valuable insight that gives you choices.

Rachel Cossar: Okay. Right. Absolutely. Well said. Awesome. So to to move on to our final question here, I mean, you’ve already shared so much that I think people can think about, but what what would you like people to think about more as they’re looking to improve their communication.

Richard Richards: It’s a great question. And and I think what I love about it is, my invitation will be When you communicate is to think less than some respects about what you communicate. But is to think about the quality of connection you have the personal the people you’re communicating to. Because I think ultimately, if we think about the connection a connection, whether it’s a person of one or an audience of a thousand right in the virtual presentation. What I’m doing is I’m thinking then through the lens of the audience. I’m thinking about how my message is landing. What am I doing to make my just learn more easily. Instead of just sort of presenting just quite frankly a deck of data and information, which may or may not be relevant to the audience or may or may not be be communicate t in a way that the audience can access it or understand or appreciate. Because again when we look at connection, we’re looking at connection at two levels. We’re looking at emotional connection. And we’ll looking at a cognitive connection and both go hand in hands. And ultimately if you think about the average buying decision right? Gal have done some work on this the average buying decision is sixty percent emotional of forty percent. Cognitive, rational, or seventy thirty, but by a large emotion

Rachel Cossar: Yeah.

Richard Richards: play such a huge part. So what does that connection look and feel like? With your audience. If you’re doing to a big presentation, have you shared enough about yourself? In terms of allowing them to relate to you to build trust in you. And if it’s a one on one, are you building a space where there’s a sense of rapport, the same sort of language the same energy that’s being passed backwards forwards. And are you conscious of the quality of that connection as you communicate.

Rachel Cossar: Right. Right. Yeah. Absolutely. I think it goes to what you said earlier where communication is more about  like you, it’s it’s it’s not always just about… Actually. It’s never really just  about you. Right? And and and it’s about how what you’re seeing lands with the audience  in that moment, How might I make them feel? And then in response to the way they react, how do you have you listened to that? How have you absorb that and digest that? So I think that’s so powerful. It’s always a helpful reminder, even even for myself, You know, we’re always always communicating. We’re always trying to have a message that lands with impact. And so really taking that preoccupation with your self out of it to really understand the the the broader hole is very powerful.

Richard Richards: Saying the messenger out some is what we’re about right. Otherwise, correct frankly, find yourself a piece of Ai that’s gonna read the text.

Rachel Cossar: Yeah.

Richard Richards: Recording video and just send that out. Because, otherwise, there’s no human into connect what we want as human beings is to be in relationship with people. Whether it’s the present who’s presenting whether it’s the news costa,  or with your math Perry, who’s actually doing a a sitcom in North America? It’s we we we crave connection relationship.

Rachel Cossar: Yep. And that doesn’t change whether the you’re in person or over video.

Richard Richards: Doesn’t change at all. It’s exactly with the same people.

Rachel Cossar: Yeah. Wonderful. Well, that will really just brings us to the end of our our time today. But Richard, I wanna thank so much for sharing your insights and being being so open to this conversation. So fascinating time, you know, we need more people like you who are really thinking about it critically and leaning in.

Richard Richards: It’s my pleasure. It’s it’s becomes sort of my passion and my role world to actually  shift this perspective about about virtual presence and how we up And so tools like yours are just one more tool than the toolbox and it’s a great tool to have.

Rachel Cossar: Yep. Wonderful. Awesome. Well, thank you so much, richard. And looking forward to the the next opportunity to connect.