The Future of Wellness Coaching

Rachel Cossar: Everyone, and welcome to another episode in conversations in the future of work. I am your host, Rachel Cossar, and today we’re talking about the future of wellness coaching. This is a huge space. There are many aspects of it that are being disrupted through technology and AI And so I’m pleased to have Neil Sundberg with us, to share his expertise in this space. Neil, over to you. Yeah. Awesome. Thank you so much, Rachel.

Neal Sundberg: And, as you said, my name is Neil Sundberg. I am the owner at Neil Sumburg, Coaching and Consulting LLC. Prior to that, I was the senior director of coaching over at Headspace, as well as Ginger, which merged in 2021. And prior to that, I was, practicing therapists as well as coach in a variety of different mental health settings, from substance use to sports housing, as well as medical clinics. And so now I I have this really incredible opportunity as we’re seeing just such a a need across the board for integrating coaches into different health care settings, which really is where my expertise lies. And so I was really excited to talk through today to discuss all of what we’re seeing in this incredibly quickly growing space. Awesome.

Rachel Cossar: So let’s get into the the first question here. I’d love to hear your thoughts on recent evolutions in this space. So wellness and mental health coaching. You know, I know that companies are there are companies that are dedicated to this specifically, and then there are companies that are trying to bring this aspect into their organization. Love to hear your thoughts on that. Yeah. Definitely.

Neal Sundberg: I think evolution is a good word because like I said, it is very quickly growing. We’re we’re seeing that. I’m seeing that a lot with my consulting work. And I think the the reason behind that is a few things. 1, I think there is a level of credibility and as well as standardization that is, being created specifically with the national board of health and wellness coaches. So, like, prior to that, and prior to to growing that, there was just kind of like the wild, wild west. Everyone was kind of calling themselves, a coach. It was a term very loosely associated. And so this has created some standardization. It’s created just a a level of credibility that I think is really needed prior to the growth of any one, any one kind of discipline. So I think that’s one side of it. I think on the company’s side, companies are really starting to see, like, there is a clear ROI here. And I think, the way that I like to explain it is if you’re you go to a a doctor’s visit, you go to a, specialist visit, they’re gonna tell you, hey, you you need to get more sleep. You need to eat healthier. You need to incorporate some stress reduction, techniques. And that’s great. And truth is you probably knew a little bit about that anyway going in. Good advice nonetheless. But what’s difficult is you leave those offices and how how do you support kind of making those changes? And so health and wellness coaches, like, if there are experts in anything, it is in behavior change specifically in that space. And so I think there’s just a huge opportunity for coaches to really provide that continuum of care. The ROI for for companies, you know, is that they’re able to they’re able to get better sooner. They’re able to reduce the amount of cost because people aren’t having more office visits, urgent care, like all of those things. Yeah. So really exciting to see that people are starting to to see that ROI that exists. Yeah. That’s that’s fascinating.

Rachel Cossar: I love that you mentioned the, you know, what happens after the session or the program or or the visit. Right? Because that’s a big part of what we focus on at Sapiens too. Right? As you know, it’s it’s the technology can really come in and help with the rewiring, like the consistent feedback, the consistent power of communities, making it more convenient for individuals to connect with coaches, Yeah. I love that. Yeah. And so true.

Neal Sundberg: Like, that’s often the thing that is said, right, is whether you’re a therapist or coaches, you have this short window of time. You’re meeting with them. That is a much longer than a doctor’s visit. But let’s say 45 to an hour or 30 minutes even, and then you have the rest of your your week. And there’s so much that happens, in between that time and to be able to, like, offer things, like you said, through virtual sapiens is a great example. Yeah. Awesome. It’s it’s so fascinating.

Rachel Cossar: And so in in keeping with this theme, like, which which disruptive technologies are you seeing that you think will be the most positive and the most lasting? Yeah. It’s a it’s a great question.

Neal Sundberg: I think the the technologies that I think will kind of rise to the top aren’t the technologies that are are trying to kind of like take over of human coaches job. I think it’s the ones that are are really trying to uplevel to really support a a coach’s work so that they can really practice, I think, at the height of their license, which I I think is so important shameless plug for virtual sapiens is kind of my own, experience. I know that I’m getting a little bit back into coaching and one of the things anytime you’re getting into something. There’s some nerves there. It’s like, do I still have it in me? Do I still have kinda what it takes? Do I still have that there? And so I was able to utilize the platform. I was able to practice, do some mock sessions, and have that, and it just got me to this level of comfort to where I’m like, oh, I can do this. I still have those skills. Like, they haven’t left me, but it was also really, provided just that safe space to to engage in that exercise. And I think, like, when you’re early on in your career as a therapist or early on as a coach, you get that level of supervision from a human even. But then as you continue in your career, that type of of supervision, that type of feedback that you once received is, like, no longer there. So I think programs like yours through through virtual sapiens offers a a really great option for that continuum of getting feedback. I think other, technologies that arise are like the ones that, like, AI note taking that kind of get away from that burden of the administrative tasks that take a long time. I I I know that that folks don’t love that. And, again, what we were saying in the first question is that time in between sessions, like, how can we make the most use out of it? Can we use biometric data in between that sessions and synthesize it to a coach or a therapist to to make more use or better use of their time so that they can be more efficient in that small window of time that they have. So I think all of those things are are super exciting, and I think the ones that all hopefully rise to the top. Right. Yeah.

Rachel Cossar: I am I think it’s really interesting. Oops. I think it’s cons oh, sorry. Interesting to to consider some of those It’s like the intersection, right, between these technologies and the and the coaches, the these certified coaches who are, you know, doing doing that nuanced level of work. Yeah. You mentioned a few bodies of of or institutions who train and accreditate. I don’t know if that’s the right word, but give coaching credentials. What are the ones that that you think are, like, the most reputable. Yeah.

Neal Sundberg: I mean, I think the the national board of health and honest coaching, I mean, I think that’s the one that, it is definitely the they’ve done an excellent job with creating like CPT codes. So, like, trying to to get insurances to to reimburse this type of work, which I think is such a large part of, the direction that we likely need to go in. There are other organizations. I know, there are ones that are more specific to sir, like, certain work. I know there is a, one that focuses on ADHD and things of that nature. I think a lot of even those that are more of the offsets will probably, in some ways, like, fall under potentially the MBHWC. And so, like, we’ll start seeing, I think, programs that are accredited by the MBHWC, but have these very specific, like, focus is, whether that’s mental health, like the program at headspace or whether that is ADHD or whether that is working with chronic care, patients, things like that. So I think we’ll see a lot more kind of sprouting out in that way. Okay.

Rachel Cossar: And then this is a question I, like, frequently have with coaching in general. Like, for mental, mental health and and and wellness or just health and wellness coaching, like, where do you see the line between, you know, health and wellness coaching and therapy.

Neal Sundberg: Like, yeah, it’s a great question and and one that I feel is asking. I I think it’s one that needs to continue to be asked because we need to to get that. And especially one interesting thing that I’m seeing is there are a lot of therapists who are actually now moving into this health and wellness coaching space as well, offering therapy, but also offering, coaching as well. And so being able to differentiate that. So so important. So I’m glad you asked. I think, the way I I like to kinda differentiate those things and there are are absolutely overlap the thing that obviously coaching isn’t is we’re not giving diagnoses. We’re not performing any type of of clinical care. The the focus of a coach is, again, that behavior change. And so coaches really focus. They’re kind of foundational education is motivational interviewing. It’s the trans theoretical models of change. It’s all of that as well as certain, types of health and wellness, topics. Too. So that’s really like the the foundation of it, which the practice of it then lends itself to really, okay, what are you experiencing right now? Where do you wanna get to? And me as the coach, like, I’m going to help you with making those changes. We’re gonna belt smart goals. We’re we’re going to to talk through what is getting in the way of making those changes. And so it’s very much more forward focus, I think, than, therapy. Right. Oh, interesting. Okay.

Rachel Cossar: That’s a really interesting way of putting it. Mhmm. Yeah. No. Thank you. I just, like, I’m, like, always. Yeah. Because I I’m I I would consider myself a facilitator. Right? I I I facilitate for programs. I’m not I wouldn’t say that I’m a coach really. And then obviously, I’m like, it’s just in even in some of the sessions that I’ve had, because what you were talking about communication and people have some very, you know, somatic ties to the way they show up and communicate, especially non verbally. And so it’s just really interesting sometimes when you’re like, okay. And now we’re getting into a space where you should consider, working through that with therapists because, like, I can’t do that with you. Totally. Yeah. And that’s such a a good call out too.

Neal Sundberg: Like, the escalation of care is so important. Like, we need to make sure we’re practicing within our scope. And I think anytime there is a question, about that being able to to address it directly with the the person that you you are coaching is is so important. Yeah. Awesome. Wow. I’m glad we covered that.

Rachel Cossar: So moving more now to to the the organizations and and companies who are trying to instill a culture of coaching. What’s like, how do you think these companies should embrace some of these changes while also putting plans in place to mitigate any concerns. And that could be concerns around technology and AI. It could be concerns around some of the stuff we just discussed. Yeah. Yeah. It’s a it’s a great question.

Neal Sundberg: I think 1st and foremost, what what comes to mind here for me is you need to have the the right people in the room. So, like, if you are thinking about developing a a coaching program, I think you have to be careful that we’re we’re not, like, coaches are not a catchall for kind of a lower cost just offering. They’re also not like customer service. Reps, and we have to be very, like, we have to hold to that integrity. And so in order to do that, like, having coaches in those rooms, making those decisions, offering consulting services, or or whatever else is so important, we saw this, I think, a lot with digital health and and even with, like, therapists, like, if it is a clinical, something that is clinical, like, having people in the room who are therapists is so important, One of the things that I love to see at Headspace and what they were doing and still do is they have their own MBHWC program or credited program. And there were so many, like, product folks and, client success sales folks that were going through that program. And so they were now understanding, okay, I have a a really strong understanding of coaching, and they were coming to me, like, after the program, like, I finally get it. Like, I know how to explain it. Like, I know how to Yeah. To to provide it and, like, in the market. And so I think that level of just knowledge and when we can provide that knowledge to product folks and others who are are building out these things is just so important and and helps mitigate some of the the concerns that we can anticipate. Right.

Rachel Cossar: And that’s an interesting point that, especially for some of these companies, like these coaching companies, whether they’re, consulting coach companies or technology companies that offer coaching as a service, you know, engaging the entire workforce in that conversation around coaching, giving them training and coaching, you know, getting them certified so that everyone I mean, coaching is such a powerful individual journey, but then especially if that’s your your product, right, making sure that everyone understands that that journey. Yeah. 100%.

Neal Sundberg: And, like, to your point, it’s not that everyone has to go through a coaching program, but if companies can clearly communicate value of coaching, what it is, like, and and I think there are different ways to to go about doing that. I think that just aligns you for future success. Totally.

Rachel Cossar: And so you you’ve left an amazing career at at headspace. You’re starting your own consulting practice. Like, what are you most looking forward to in the year ahead? Yeah.

Neal Sundberg: I’m I I think single word is just like collaboration, just getting the opportunity because this is such a growing field to collaborate with different people across the field is so exciting. I think there is is so much opportunity out there, and I’ve been fortunate enough very early on in my consulting career to to kind of see and experience all of these different synergies and partnerships, which has been really exciting. I think a few examples is like, some of the work they’re doing over at a company pillar. They have, like, a coach hiring network. Like, I’ve been able to to connect some folks over there. I think what they do is great. There’s, companies like shimmer that focus on ADHD coaching, And so I think what’s really exciting for me is when you’re in the startup world, understandably, there’s a lot of competition. There’s everyone is trying to to get kind of to the top. And I think that’s fair and valid and completely makes sense in competitive markets. And I think what I’m excited to to really engage in is like, how can this company support this company? How can we come together to really more than anything? I think clearly articulate the value of coaching, clearly articulate what health and wellness coaching is to these these different health care settings and just the overall population so that it can be something that 5 years, 10 years down the line, like, it’s normal for your doctor to offer you a referral to to see a a coach for that ongoing continuum of care. And I think, like, yeah, it’s really up to us, I think, to to to work together on making that future kind of vision a reality. So all of those things, really excite me. I’ll be remiss too to not mention the the coaching and technology summit over at NYU, which is really exciting and part of how we’ve been connected because I think that offers such, an opportunity for folks to come together, to brainstorm, to to learn from one another, as well as, find these incredible partnerships that, can occur. So really excited for that and definitely wanna just shout out for anyone interested in that. Like, we’re we’re building out this kind of health and wellness coaching side of that, summit and just really exciting to to see what going to to occur there. That’s awesome. Yeah.

Rachel Cossar: I mean, it’s a it’s a wonderful world, and it’s it’s starting to, like, the access I feel like is really starting to, widen, which is all always nice to see. Absolutely. Yeah.

Neal Sundberg: So so exciting and just, yeah, the future, I think, is uncertain, but also I I’m incredibly optimistic of where we’re going. Wonderful.

Rachel Cossar: Well, Neil, thank you so much for taking the time in this busy transition period, to share your insights with us. I think it’s fascinating. Some of the things you’ve shared. How can people connect with you or follow more of your work? Yeah. So definitely my website.

Neal Sundberg: So going to coaching to consulting dot come to t o, you’ll find if this is like something that you wanna engage in if your company needs consulting services, if you’re just interested in getting, to be a part of the NYU, conference, definitely reach out, connect. I I have a blog on there. LinkedIn, obviously, a huge advocate for that. I think that’s created a a ton of partnerships so you can find it there as well. But don’t be a stranger. Like, if anything, I think that I’ve shared has resonated with you. Again, one of my most exciting things during this time has just been connecting with different people across the field. So definitely wanna hear from folks and hear what they’re doing. Awesome. Well, thank you again, Neil.

Rachel Cossar: And as always, thanks to our audience for tuning in. And we’ll see you we’ll see you next time. Awesome. Thanks so much, Rachel. Take care.